[Owasp-leaders] [Owasp-community] Project and Chapter Funding Proposal

mike.francis at owasp.org mike.francis at owasp.org
Thu Oct 8 06:49:30 UTC 2015


Jim,

I'll join you if there's cooked sushi:)

Regards
Mike 

> On Oct 7, 2015, at 23:44, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org> wrote:
> 
> Richard,
> 
> You run one of the largest and most active chapters at OWASP. You're trying to protect the funds that you actively need and use. Don't be sorry dude. Thank you for diving into this with us. I'm glad the proposal is somewhat closer to your liking.
> 
> Next time I'm in LA the sushi is on me. :)
> 
> Aloha,
> --
> Jim Manico
> Global Board Member
> OWASP Foundation
> https://www.owasp.org
> 
>> On Oct 8, 2015, at 1:51 AM, Richard Greenberg <richard.greenberg at owasp.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Josh,
>> It is clear to me know. When you wrote that any chapter leader can create a budget, I was thinking in terms of money that leader managed. My apologies.
>> 
>> Richard Greenberg, CISSP
>> President, OWASP Los Angeles, 
>> www.owaspla.org
>> ISSA Fellow
>> President, ISSA Los Angeles, 
>> www.issa-la.org
>> LinkedIn:  http://www.linkedin.com/in/richardagreenberg
>> 
>> (424) 261-8111
>> 
>>    
>> 
>>> On Oct 6, 2015 8:27 AM, "Josh Sokol" <josh.sokol at owasp.org> wrote:
>>> Azzedine, I updated the language there to try to make the intent more clear:
>>> 
>>> Separate from the aforementioned budgeting process for chapter and project accounts, any OWASP Leader can create a budget and provide it to the OWASP Board prior to November 1 for inclusion in the Foundation budget planning process.  The budget would be reviewed by the Executive Director and Board, and, if approved, incorporated into the overall OWASP Foundation budget for the following year.  This would effectively set aside the funds to use at the appropriate period of time, in the future, with no further approvals necessary.  Money that is budgeted in this manner, that wasn’t spent during the calendar year, would be returned back to the OWASP Foundation general funds.
>>> 
>>> The idea is that this has nothing to do with the standard budgeting process for a chapter or a project.  It is a separated channel through which an OWASP Leader can request funds for initiatives that do not have funding.  I'll use the Project Summit as an example.  It's an excellent initiative and one we should support.  It's also expensive and something that would be far better if we could budget for it in advance.  This proposal would give the Leader organizing the summit the ability to create a plan and request funds in absence of any money in an account designated for the event.  If approved, it authorizes them to spend the money just as if it were in a chapter or project account.  The reason for the last sentence is that this is not money "earned" as is the case for money in the chapter or project accounts.  It is money that is "requested" from the Foundation resources.  If the money is not spent, then the Foundation needs to be able to re-allocate it to other things.  The Leader can always re-request it, in the future, when they are again ready to execute.  
>>> 
>>> Richard, again, see my explanation above.  This has nothing to do with chapter or project accounts or funds.  This is a separate process.  Your objection seems to be based around not wanting to give up your chapter's money, but there is nothing there that would actually take any of your current funds away.  I'm not sure I understand.
>>> 
>>> ~josh
>>> 
>>>> On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 12:15 AM, Azzeddine Ramrami <azzeddine.ramrami at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>> Hi Jim, Hi Josh,
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks for the proposal Josh and Jim. Very good initiative.
>>>> 
>>>> I agree with all points except this one (I joind Richard):
>>>> 
>>>> "Budgeted money that wasn’t spent during the calendar year would be returned back to the OWASP Foundation general funds."
>>>> 
>>>> Chapter's budget are very critical for meeting, events and more. 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Why? It is really difficult to collect found (for my Chapter it is impossible now) and for my project (CSRFGuard) I received a thousand of support request without any donation or help.
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks.
>>>> Azzeddine
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Thu, Oct 1, 2015 at 9:23 AM, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>> Richard, if you remove that one aspect of the proposal, what do you think about the other 9 points?
>>>>> 
>>>>> - Jim
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 9/30/15 8:40 PM, Richard Greenberg wrote:
>>>>>> Thanks for the proposal Josh and Jim. Sadly, I         cannot support this. "Budgeted money that wasn’t spent during the calendar year would be returned back to the OWASP Foundation general funds." No, that will not work. Our chapter meeting attendance shot up to 80-120 once we started providing a catered dinner, paid for by vendor support and our yearly conference. We loose our money to the Foundation, and we are moving month to month without any backup funding. This is no way to run a chapter. We have reserves for the months we cannot get a sponsor. 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Please do not lecture me about attendees should want to attend even if we don't provide food. That is a bad statement. We want attendees, and if have to entice them, so be it. Getting the word out about secure development trumps any philosophical differences anyone may have.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Basically, in an attempt to manage the finances, you risk alienating the very essence of who OWASP is: the Chapters. Chapters need control of their own budgets. We do all the heavy lifting to generate our own income. We deserve to manage it. 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> You want to see a budget? That is reasonable. You threaten to take away our money? Absolutely the wrong approach. Terrible proposal!!
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Richard Greenberg, CISSP
>>>>>> President, OWASP Los Angeles, www.owaspla.org
>>>>>> ISSA Fellow
>>>>>> VP, ISSA Los Angeles, www.issa-la.org
>>>>>> LinkedIn:  http://www.linkedin.com/in/richardagreenberg
>>>>>> (424) 261-8111
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Tue, Sep 29, 2015 at 10:41 AM, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> Hello all,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> If you have a moment, please take a look at the funding proposal below. The board is going to vote on this soon. I'd be grateful if you had time to review and provide comments.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>> Jim Manico
>>>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On 9/25/15 10:20 PM, Jim Manico wrote:
>>>>>>>> OWASP Community,
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Josh Sokol proposed a major funding initiative for projects and chapters at the OWASP global board meeting earlier today.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org/index.php/Proposal_for_2015-09-25_OWASP_Board_Meeting 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I personally think this is an excellent proposal and would like to call for a board vote early next week so our staff can prep for this for 2016.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> In the spirit of transparency and even more important - getting valuable feedback from the community - we are publishing this proposal to the community at large.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Please read this carefully and let us know what you think https://www.owasp.org/index.php/Proposal_for_2015-09-25_OWASP_Board_Meeting
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Aloha,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Owasp-community mailing list
>>>>>>> Owasp-community at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-community
>>>>> 
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> Jim Manico
>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Owasp-community mailing list
>>>>> Owasp-community at lists.owasp.org
>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-community
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> Azzeddine RAMRAMI
>>>> +33 6 65 48 90 04.
>>>> Enterprise Security Architect
>>>> OWASP Leader (Morocco Chapter)
>>>> Mozilla Security Projects Mentor
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