[Owasp-leaders] OWASP Top 10 2012

Mark Curphey mark at curphey.com
Fri Oct 7 12:11:42 EDT 2011


Information architecture is an interesting issue. Quora or SO are cool and very dev friendly but assumes you navigate with Google (cough cough, I meant Bing of course :-) my gut says a set of filters and tagging can elegantly solve this on OWASP.org but totally breaks when you consider http://www.brakemanscanner.org and http://www.myesapi.org and O2 site etc.




Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 7, 2011, at 8:41 AM, Chris Schmidt <chris.schmidt at owasp.org> wrote:

> I think this illustrates a point pretty accurately - this has the potential to blow up into something completely unmaintainable and not-user-friendly in a heartbeat. Perhaps the answer is that instead of new documents, a new EcoSystem/Community should be built around the Top 10 project that enables the community to interact with questions like 
> 
> How do I resolve T10.1 in my PHP application that uses the PHP-Java Bridge to invoke business functions in my Spring driven Java business layer?
> 
> This would be a good place for something like a Stack Overflow type Q&A framework to *compliment* the top 10.. Make sense?
> 
> And yes, I realize this contradicts my previous post a little, the important thing is that the T10 is an industry impactful project and I believe there is both room for growth and the community desire for *moar factz* as it were. That was the main intent of my previous reply, this is just another suggestion on how to get there.
> 
> My $0.02
> 
> On 10/7/2011 9:35 AM, Mark Curphey wrote:
>> 
>> The sandwich ordering. I want OWASP top ten, on .net, with a c# filling and a bag of AWS to go :-)
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Oct 7, 2011, at 8:24 AM, John Melton <jtmelton at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> I agree with several of the opinions expressed here. I tend to think of this in a wizard style approach (there's been talk of this style of organization in other project areas as well, I think Curphey had this in his keynote from appsecusa). For instance, I personally am a Java guy, so I'd logically like to have a flow that says Top 10 list -> CSRF (Issue I have) -> choose technology -> Java -> choose framework(s) -> Struts 2 -> now get prescriptive guidance. To me that's the simplest and most logical flow for developers. I have no idea how a flow like that would work within the wiki, btw. Just speaking for Java, I think there's little value in providing solutions unless you give framework-specific (not just language-specific) guidance, since that's where most devs live. 
>>> 
>>> Clearly the top 10 has had tremendous impact on the industry - this seems like a very logical place to start given the recent focus of strong developer outreach. The top 10 doc is probably the 1 item OWASP produces that is in the hands of more developers than anything else (from my experience), so giving them solid solutions seems a good idea.
>>> 
>>> As an aside, my top 10 blog set was really meant to show the power of ESAPI. So while it is Java specific, there are often more framework compliant ways to accomplish the solutions (like token solutions for CSRF in all the frameworks).
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> John
>>> 
>>> On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 11:04 AM, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org> wrote:
>>> Exactly! First of all, Troy Hunt is a total rockstar. He is mirroring
>>> the OWASP Top Ten in a way that is 100% .NET branded for .NET
>>> developers with .NET solutions.
>>> 
>>> Even if the actually high level items are the same as the general Top
>>> Ten, the language branded versions reach developers and speak to
>>> developers in a pretty deep way.
>>> 
>>> The devil is in the detail - and unlike the general Top Ten, Troy's
>>> work provides fairly deep prescriptive language-specific solutions.
>>> 
>>> There are several bloggers (Melton?) who have pushed out Java centric
>>> Top Ten literature. The groundwork is out there. I'd love to see a
>>> group managed by Dave's penchant for detail to produce (at least)
>>> official OWASP Java,  .NET and PHP Top Ten documents. I think this is
>>> a better approach than just providing language specific examples in
>>> the general doc for the sake of deeply influencing developers.
>>> 
>>> IMO,
>>> --
>>> Jim Manico
>>> (808) 652-3805
>>> 
>>> On Oct 7, 2011, at 9:53 AM, Mark Curphey <mark at curphey.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> > Troy hunt has already done a series on T10 and .net. He's a .net security MVP.  I am sure he'll donate. Shall I ask him?
>>> >
>>> > Sent from my iPhone
>>> >
>>> > On Oct 7, 2011, at 7:21 AM, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> Yes, you are right on. It's a crucial way to influence developers more
>>> >> - and influencing developers is the real mission of OWASP from days of
>>> >> yore. Shall we get started? I'll lend a hand.
>>> >>
>>> >> --
>>> >> Jim Manico
>>> >> (808) 652-3805
>>> >>
>>> >> On Oct 7, 2011, at 9:18 AM, Erwin Geirnaert
>>> >> <erwin.geirnaert at zionsecurity.com> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >>> Hi list,
>>> >>>
>>> >>> During some discussions this week with Java developers while giving a security training I got the following remark: "why are there so many ASP.NET/PHP issues in the OWASP Top 10, is Java more secure"?
>>> >>>
>>> >>> So what I propose is to create a specific OWASP Top 10 for different technologies: Microsoft, Java, PHP and we can still have one global Top 10.
>>> >>> Ofcourse based on the CVE database but it will be more clear for the developers and I think that the OWASP Top 10 for Java will be very different than OWASP Top 10 for PHP.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Best regards,
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Erwin
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>> 
>> 
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