[Owasp-board] Board Attendance Fabio - VOTE REQUEST

Josh Sokol josh.sokol at owasp.org
Sat Aug 22 14:57:20 UTC 2015


Matt still hasn't checked in, but with votes of CONFIDENCE by Jim, Andrew,
Michael, Tobias, and myself, there is no way that half of the votes could
be achieved for removal and an overall vote of CONFIDENCE in Fabio has been
recorded.  Matt, would you like to record a vote for the official record?
Paul, can you please make sure to include this in the list of Board votes?
Thanks.

I will start a separate thread for discussion on a Bylaw change now that
this situation has been handled.

~josh

On Sat, Aug 22, 2015 at 3:36 AM, Andrew van der Stock <vanderaj at owasp.org>
wrote:

> +1000 for lowering the bar
>
> I think voting on measures is a better kpi than meeting attendance.
>
> Fabio and I have been trying to catch each other in person for over a week
> now. It's challenging!
>
> Thanks
> Andrew
> On 22 Aug 2015 16:33, "Tobias" <tobias.gondrom at owasp.org> wrote:
>
>> I vote "Confidence".
>> @Matt: could you please record the results of this vote on our voting
>> history page.
>>
>> Best regards, Tobias
>>
>>
>> Ps.: actually, I believe due to our globally distributed board and the
>> challenges from the different time zones, the bar of 75% is too high.
>> Furthermore, I note that all current board members are active in
>> discussions on the mailing-lists, where also a lot of business is
>> conducted. So I feel a lower attendance bar would not hinder an effective
>> board work.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 22/08/15 08:46, Michael Coates wrote:
>>
>> I think this is good to evaluate to our existing policy.
>>
>> I do vote "confidence".
>>
>> Perhaps we should consider more written notes of contribution from each
>> board member so we can better represent our efforts in the event we aren't
>> present at board meetings. Just an idea for consideration in our overall
>> approach.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Michael Coates | @_mwc <https://twitter.com/intent/user?screen_name=_mwc>
>> OWASP Global Board
>> Join me at AppSecUSA <http://AppSecUSA.org> 2015 in San Francisco!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 20, 2015 at 5:12 PM, Andrew van der Stock <vanderaj at owasp.org
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> I vote "Confidence" in Fabio.
>>>
>>> Andrew
>>>
>>> On Wed, Aug 19, 2015 at 5:54 AM, Josh Sokol <josh.sokol at owasp.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> My vote is "Confidence" for Fabio to remain on the Board on the basis
>>>> of the current Bylaw being unspecific, but I think that the Board needs to
>>>> clarify this discrepancy immediately following the vote and I think that
>>>> Fabio needs to be put on notice that missing any other meetings puts him
>>>> under 75% with no ability to go back over 75%.
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 2:31 PM, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> My vote is "Confidence" for Fabio to remain on the board.
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Jim Manico
>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA <http://appsecusa.org/> 2015!
>>>>>
>>>>> On Aug 18, 2015, at 9:14 AM, Josh Sokol <josh.sokol at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> No motion should be necessary as the Bylaws specify that a vote is
>>>>> automatically initiated.  Board, the Bylaws specify:
>>>>>
>>>>> *Failure by a board member to meet the 75% attendance requirement
>>>>> after any tabulation will cause a mandatory vote of confidence by the
>>>>> remaining board members, whose votes will be publicly recorded.  An overall
>>>>> vote of "no confidence" is recorded if half or more of the board members
>>>>> vote for it, which causes the board member in question to be instantly
>>>>> removed from their seat on the board.*
>>>>>
>>>>> As already stated, Fabio has fallen below the minimum 75% attendance
>>>>> and a mandatory vote of confidence is necessary.  Please provide your vote
>>>>> of "CONFIDENCE" or "NO CONFIDENCE" for Fabio's participation on the Board.
>>>>>
>>>>> ~josh
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 1:54 PM, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The vote is mandatory per bylaws. Let's do it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *I move we vote to decide whether to remove Fabio from the board per
>>>>>> our bylaws. Any second?*
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Failure by a board member to meet the 75% attendance requirement
>>>>>> after any tabulation will cause a mandatory vote of confidence by the
>>>>>> remaining board members, whose votes will be publicly recorded.  An overall
>>>>>> vote of "no confidence" is recorded if half or more of the board members
>>>>>> vote for it, which causes the board member in question to be instantly
>>>>>> removed from their seat on the board. *Does anyone second this
>>>>>> request to vote?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you all,
>>>>>> Jim
>>>>>>
>>>>>> PS: When it comes back to me, my vote is NO do NOT remove Fabio from
>>>>>> the board.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 8/18/15 4:22 AM, Fabio Cerullo wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are a few boards members that are in the verge of
>>>>>> non-compliance with the 75% attendance so I think we need to review that
>>>>>> requirement at the next Board meeting.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To my view, this requirement is in place if a board member is not
>>>>>> engaged in his/her duties… I believe all current board members are quite
>>>>>> active and dedicate countless of hours to the Foundation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Out of the 3 times I missed the meetings, 2 of them were at midnight
>>>>>> which unfortunately I couldn't attend.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If the Board believes a vote is needed under the current bylaws I’m
>>>>>> fine with it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Fabio Cerullo
>>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015 <https://2015.appsecusa.org> in
>>>>>> San Francisco!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 17 Aug 2015, at 04:55, Andrew van der Stock <vanderaj at owasp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As noted above, the pain needs to be shared around. I've made more
>>>>>> than my fair share of unsociable board times, including 4 am and 5 am
>>>>>> meetings. I don't expect 100% attendance under those circumstances, as
>>>>>> there's no good time for all of us, and I am sure with missing two board
>>>>>> meetings this year, I am perilously close to hitting that 75% mark as well.
>>>>>> That said, as long as the unsociable hours done for me and Jim for the rest
>>>>>> of the year, there's no reason why I will not be at the rest of the Board
>>>>>> meetings this year.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> thanks
>>>>>> Andrew
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 8:24 PM, Tobias <tobias.gondrom at owasp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We could make changes if the board wants.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My mean reason is that we now have a much more global board and that
>>>>>>> finding time slots that are ok for most is not always easy. Equally, I
>>>>>>> would not want us to discriminate board members from other regions just
>>>>>>> because the timezone is making attending very hard.
>>>>>>> Technically, there have been board meetings for some participants
>>>>>>> (from Hawaii, Australia and Asia) at times like 6:00am, midnight, 1:00am
>>>>>>> (and at the beginning of the year also two times I believe also at 4:00am
>>>>>>> Australia time).
>>>>>>> We try our best to find good times and to spread the pain more
>>>>>>> equally, but it is not always easy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Maybe the 75% mark is a bit high considering the global distribution
>>>>>>> of our board.
>>>>>>> And/or we change from "must" to "may".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Up to what the board and community feels is tolerable.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Just a thought.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best, Tobias
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 15/08/15 03:29, Jim Manico wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well said Paul. I do not think a forced vote is necessary. I agree
>>>>>>> with your suggestion that we change the bylaws on this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Jim Manico
>>>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA <http://appsecusa.org/> 2015!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Aug 14, 2015, at 5:34 AM, Paul Ritchie <paul.ritchie at owasp.org>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi All:    I double checked the policy on the 75% Rule we just
>>>>>>> approved back in May of this year, and it does allow some flexibility.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> However, the wording does say "*Failure by a board member to meet
>>>>>>> the 75% attendance requirement after any tabulation will cause a mandatory
>>>>>>> vote of confidence....." *
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Personally, as we make other changes to bylaws, I would recommend we
>>>>>>> change this to* "...may cause a vote..."*    This will give the
>>>>>>> Board flexibility to have a off-line, profession talk with anyone missing a
>>>>>>> few board meetings 'first', before going to a vote.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So, for now, we can add this to the Sept. board agenda under "house
>>>>>>> keeping", and simply "acknowledge the attendance gap, with a legitimate
>>>>>>> explanation".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think we all recognize and greatly appreciate the work Fabio is
>>>>>>> doing on behalf of OWASP, so a change to the wording of the bylaws may be
>>>>>>> the best path forward.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best Regards, Paul Ritchie
>>>>>>> OWASP Executive Director
>>>>>>> paul.ritchie at owasp.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 8:05 AM, Josh Sokol <josh.sokol at owasp.org>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I will admit that the last meeting time was inconvenient for me as
>>>>>>>> well, but the the idea was to spread around the pain of meeting times.
>>>>>>>> Andrew and Jim have suffered through early and late meeting times as well.
>>>>>>>> It is not a big deal, and is almost expected, that you will miss a meeting
>>>>>>>> or two.  That is OK.  But I'm not sure you can say "It was at midnight" for
>>>>>>>> the February and March meetings that were missed as well and I think that
>>>>>>>> was Jim's point.  Right now, you are OK, as long as you make the remaining
>>>>>>>> meetings this year.  If you don't, then a vote COULD be taken to remove
>>>>>>>> you.  That said, considering you aren't running for re-election, I'm not
>>>>>>>> sure what the point would be in removing you so close to the end of your
>>>>>>>> term anyway.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ~josh
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 5:04 AM, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Fabio,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I was in the process of updating the board attendance when I
>>>>>>>>> noticed this.
>>>>>>>>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1wpaOCBP-qrnde0sLiglDMJOUCtse6oB-zf3ONCkWgZk/edit?pli=1#gid=6
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I do not blame you for missing meetings at midnight. We might want
>>>>>>>>> to revisit this policy since the board is so global.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Jim Manico
>>>>>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>>>>>> OWASP Foundationhttps://www.owasp.org
>>>>>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 8/13/15 10:37 PM, Fabio Cerullo wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Jim,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks for checking my attendance to the Board meetings.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The meeting this week was at midnight (Irish time) based on the
>>>>>>>>> schedule published:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org/index.php/Board#tab=Agenda_for_2015_Meetings
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I’m afraid cannot attend during those hours so will appreciate if
>>>>>>>>> the times could be reviewed?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Please don’t worry about the next one, I will be in San Francisco
>>>>>>>>> time zone (PST).
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Fabio Cerullo
>>>>>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>>>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015 <https://2015.appsecusa.org/> in
>>>>>>>>> San Francisco!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 13 Aug 2015, at 22:30, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Fabio,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Your attendance to OWASP Board meetings in 2015 dropped to 62%
>>>>>>>>> yesterday which puts you under the required 75% per our bylaws.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If you attend every other board meeting this year, you will be at
>>>>>>>>> exactly 75% attendance, your minimum required attendance.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If you miss another meeting, you are NOT immediately removed from
>>>>>>>>> the board. It requires a vote.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> FYI,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Jim Manico
>>>>>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>>>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing listOwasp-board at lists.owasp.orghttps://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing listOwasp-board at lists.owasp.orghttps://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Jim Manico
>>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>>> OWASP Foundationhttps://www.owasp.org
>>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
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