[Owasp-board] Board Attendance Fabio - VOTE REQUEST

Andrew van der Stock vanderaj at owasp.org
Sat Aug 22 08:36:51 UTC 2015


+1000 for lowering the bar

I think voting on measures is a better kpi than meeting attendance.

Fabio and I have been trying to catch each other in person for over a week
now. It's challenging!

Thanks
Andrew
On 22 Aug 2015 16:33, "Tobias" <tobias.gondrom at owasp.org> wrote:

> I vote "Confidence".
> @Matt: could you please record the results of this vote on our voting
> history page.
>
> Best regards, Tobias
>
>
> Ps.: actually, I believe due to our globally distributed board and the
> challenges from the different time zones, the bar of 75% is too high.
> Furthermore, I note that all current board members are active in
> discussions on the mailing-lists, where also a lot of business is
> conducted. So I feel a lower attendance bar would not hinder an effective
> board work.
>
>
>
> On 22/08/15 08:46, Michael Coates wrote:
>
> I think this is good to evaluate to our existing policy.
>
> I do vote "confidence".
>
> Perhaps we should consider more written notes of contribution from each
> board member so we can better represent our efforts in the event we aren't
> present at board meetings. Just an idea for consideration in our overall
> approach.
>
>
> --
> Michael Coates | @_mwc <https://twitter.com/intent/user?screen_name=_mwc>
> OWASP Global Board
> Join me at AppSecUSA <http://AppSecUSA.org> 2015 in San Francisco!
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 20, 2015 at 5:12 PM, Andrew van der Stock <vanderaj at owasp.org>
> wrote:
>
>> I vote "Confidence" in Fabio.
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 19, 2015 at 5:54 AM, Josh Sokol <josh.sokol at owasp.org> wrote:
>>
>>> My vote is "Confidence" for Fabio to remain on the Board on the basis of
>>> the current Bylaw being unspecific, but I think that the Board needs to
>>> clarify this discrepancy immediately following the vote and I think that
>>> Fabio needs to be put on notice that missing any other meetings puts him
>>> under 75% with no ability to go back over 75%.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 2:31 PM, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> My vote is "Confidence" for Fabio to remain on the board.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Jim Manico
>>>> Global Board Member
>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA <http://appsecusa.org/> 2015!
>>>>
>>>> On Aug 18, 2015, at 9:14 AM, Josh Sokol <josh.sokol at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> No motion should be necessary as the Bylaws specify that a vote is
>>>> automatically initiated.  Board, the Bylaws specify:
>>>>
>>>> *Failure by a board member to meet the 75% attendance requirement after
>>>> any tabulation will cause a mandatory vote of confidence by the remaining
>>>> board members, whose votes will be publicly recorded.  An overall vote of
>>>> "no confidence" is recorded if half or more of the board members vote for
>>>> it, which causes the board member in question to be instantly removed from
>>>> their seat on the board.*
>>>>
>>>> As already stated, Fabio has fallen below the minimum 75% attendance
>>>> and a mandatory vote of confidence is necessary.  Please provide your vote
>>>> of "CONFIDENCE" or "NO CONFIDENCE" for Fabio's participation on the Board.
>>>>
>>>> ~josh
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 1:54 PM, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The vote is mandatory per bylaws. Let's do it.
>>>>>
>>>>> *I move we vote to decide whether to remove Fabio from the board per
>>>>> our bylaws. Any second?*
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Failure by a board member to meet the 75% attendance requirement
>>>>> after any tabulation will cause a mandatory vote of confidence by the
>>>>> remaining board members, whose votes will be publicly recorded.  An overall
>>>>> vote of "no confidence" is recorded if half or more of the board members
>>>>> vote for it, which causes the board member in question to be instantly
>>>>> removed from their seat on the board. *Does anyone second this
>>>>> request to vote?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thank you all,
>>>>> Jim
>>>>>
>>>>> PS: When it comes back to me, my vote is NO do NOT remove Fabio from
>>>>> the board.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 8/18/15 4:22 AM, Fabio Cerullo wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> There are a few boards members that are in the verge of non-compliance
>>>>> with the 75% attendance so I think we need to review that requirement at
>>>>> the next Board meeting.
>>>>>
>>>>> To my view, this requirement is in place if a board member is not
>>>>> engaged in his/her duties… I believe all current board members are quite
>>>>> active and dedicate countless of hours to the Foundation.
>>>>>
>>>>> Out of the 3 times I missed the meetings, 2 of them were at midnight
>>>>> which unfortunately I couldn't attend.
>>>>>
>>>>> If the Board believes a vote is needed under the current bylaws I’m
>>>>> fine with it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> Fabio Cerullo
>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015 <https://2015.appsecusa.org> in
>>>>> San Francisco!
>>>>>
>>>>> On 17 Aug 2015, at 04:55, Andrew van der Stock <vanderaj at owasp.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> As noted above, the pain needs to be shared around. I've made more
>>>>> than my fair share of unsociable board times, including 4 am and 5 am
>>>>> meetings. I don't expect 100% attendance under those circumstances, as
>>>>> there's no good time for all of us, and I am sure with missing two board
>>>>> meetings this year, I am perilously close to hitting that 75% mark as well.
>>>>> That said, as long as the unsociable hours done for me and Jim for the rest
>>>>> of the year, there's no reason why I will not be at the rest of the Board
>>>>> meetings this year.
>>>>>
>>>>> thanks
>>>>> Andrew
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 8:24 PM, Tobias <tobias.gondrom at owasp.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I agree.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We could make changes if the board wants.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My mean reason is that we now have a much more global board and that
>>>>>> finding time slots that are ok for most is not always easy. Equally, I
>>>>>> would not want us to discriminate board members from other regions just
>>>>>> because the timezone is making attending very hard.
>>>>>> Technically, there have been board meetings for some participants
>>>>>> (from Hawaii, Australia and Asia) at times like 6:00am, midnight, 1:00am
>>>>>> (and at the beginning of the year also two times I believe also at 4:00am
>>>>>> Australia time).
>>>>>> We try our best to find good times and to spread the pain more
>>>>>> equally, but it is not always easy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maybe the 75% mark is a bit high considering the global distribution
>>>>>> of our board.
>>>>>> And/or we change from "must" to "may".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Up to what the board and community feels is tolerable.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Just a thought.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best, Tobias
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 15/08/15 03:29, Jim Manico wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Well said Paul. I do not think a forced vote is necessary. I agree
>>>>>> with your suggestion that we change the bylaws on this.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Jim Manico
>>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA <http://appsecusa.org/> 2015!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Aug 14, 2015, at 5:34 AM, Paul Ritchie <paul.ritchie at owasp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi All:    I double checked the policy on the 75% Rule we just
>>>>>> approved back in May of this year, and it does allow some flexibility.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, the wording does say "*Failure by a board member to meet
>>>>>> the 75% attendance requirement after any tabulation will cause a mandatory
>>>>>> vote of confidence....." *
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Personally, as we make other changes to bylaws, I would recommend we
>>>>>> change this to* "...may cause a vote..."*    This will give the
>>>>>> Board flexibility to have a off-line, profession talk with anyone missing a
>>>>>> few board meetings 'first', before going to a vote.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So, for now, we can add this to the Sept. board agenda under "house
>>>>>> keeping", and simply "acknowledge the attendance gap, with a legitimate
>>>>>> explanation".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think we all recognize and greatly appreciate the work Fabio is
>>>>>> doing on behalf of OWASP, so a change to the wording of the bylaws may be
>>>>>> the best path forward.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best Regards, Paul Ritchie
>>>>>> OWASP Executive Director
>>>>>> paul.ritchie at owasp.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 8:05 AM, Josh Sokol <josh.sokol at owasp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I will admit that the last meeting time was inconvenient for me as
>>>>>>> well, but the the idea was to spread around the pain of meeting times.
>>>>>>> Andrew and Jim have suffered through early and late meeting times as well.
>>>>>>> It is not a big deal, and is almost expected, that you will miss a meeting
>>>>>>> or two.  That is OK.  But I'm not sure you can say "It was at midnight" for
>>>>>>> the February and March meetings that were missed as well and I think that
>>>>>>> was Jim's point.  Right now, you are OK, as long as you make the remaining
>>>>>>> meetings this year.  If you don't, then a vote COULD be taken to remove
>>>>>>> you.  That said, considering you aren't running for re-election, I'm not
>>>>>>> sure what the point would be in removing you so close to the end of your
>>>>>>> term anyway.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ~josh
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 5:04 AM, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Fabio,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I was in the process of updating the board attendance when I
>>>>>>>> noticed this.
>>>>>>>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1wpaOCBP-qrnde0sLiglDMJOUCtse6oB-zf3ONCkWgZk/edit?pli=1#gid=6
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I do not blame you for missing meetings at midnight. We might want
>>>>>>>> to revisit this policy since the board is so global.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Jim Manico
>>>>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>>>>> OWASP Foundationhttps://www.owasp.org
>>>>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 8/13/15 10:37 PM, Fabio Cerullo wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Jim,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks for checking my attendance to the Board meetings.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The meeting this week was at midnight (Irish time) based on the
>>>>>>>> schedule published:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org/index.php/Board#tab=Agenda_for_2015_Meetings
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I’m afraid cannot attend during those hours so will appreciate if
>>>>>>>> the times could be reviewed?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Please don’t worry about the next one, I will be in San Francisco
>>>>>>>> time zone (PST).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Fabio Cerullo
>>>>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015 <https://2015.appsecusa.org/> in
>>>>>>>> San Francisco!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 13 Aug 2015, at 22:30, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Fabio,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Your attendance to OWASP Board meetings in 2015 dropped to 62%
>>>>>>>> yesterday which puts you under the required 75% per our bylaws.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you attend every other board meeting this year, you will be at
>>>>>>>> exactly 75% attendance, your minimum required attendance.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you miss another meeting, you are NOT immediately removed from
>>>>>>>> the board. It requires a vote.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> FYI,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Jim Manico
>>>>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org
>>>>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Owasp-board mailing listOwasp-board at lists.owasp.orghttps://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Jim Manico
>>>>> Global Board Member
>>>>> OWASP Foundationhttps://www.owasp.org
>>>>> Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
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>>
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