[Owasp-board] For Discussion - Hourly contractor for wiki housekeeping

Jim Manico jim.manico at owasp.org
Mon Aug 10 20:58:56 UTC 2015


The current editing team includes a few from Germany and a few from the US.

I am free the next 2 weeks from noon-? Pacific time. I would be super 
stoked if you help set this up - I'll be there ready to deliver a good 
pretension on the topic. Cool?

Aloha,
Jim


On 8/10/15 10:57 AM, Noreen Whysel wrote:
> When is a good time for you for a wiki editing hangout? Do we have a 
> sense of where people on the current editing team live?
>
> Noreen Whysel
> Community Manager
> OWASP Foundation
>
> On Mon, Aug 10, 2015 at 4:52 PM, Jim Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org 
> <mailto:jim.manico at owasp.org>> wrote:
>
>     > Do you all think we should have an open call scheduled for
>     people intrested in the wiki editing team (and refresher for those
>     already on it) to walk them through how to edit the wiki and the
>     FIXME process?
>
>     Please, I should have been doing more of this the past few months
>     - I'll take any help to spread awareness of the wiki editor team.
>     Thanks!
>
>     > I am also planning to add a session on wiki editing to the
>     Chapter Leaders Workshop.
>
>     I'm a wiki ninja, I'd be glad to help with this. :)
>
>     Aloha
>     Jim
>
>
>
>     On 8/10/15 10:51 AM, Noreen Whysel wrote:
>>     I am also planning to add a session on wiki editing to the
>>     Chapter Leaders Workshop. I could turn that into a training for
>>     the wiki editing team. I created a course for the NYC Hackathon
>>     earlier this year but it was more about AppSec in Wikipedia
>>     instead of just the owasp.org <http://owasp.org> website.
>>
>>     Noreen Whysel
>>     Community Manager
>>     OWASP Foundation
>>
>>     On Mon, Aug 10, 2015 at 4:44 PM, Noreen Whysel
>>     <noreen.whysel at owasp.org <mailto:noreen.whysel at owasp.org>> wrote:
>>
>>         Do you all think we should have an open call scheduled for
>>         people intrested in the wiki editing team (and refresher for
>>         those already on it) to walk them through how to edit the
>>         wiki and the FIXME process?
>>
>>         Noreen Whysel
>>         Community Manager
>>         OWASP Foundation
>>
>>         On Mon, Aug 10, 2015 at 4:31 PM, Jim Manico
>>         <jim.manico at owasp.org <mailto:jim.manico at owasp.org>> wrote:
>>
>>             I lead the editors team and have admin wiki access myself.
>>
>>             An I'm sorry if this is a hassle - I am happy to work
>>             with you to streamline this or give you elevated access
>>             once we get rolling.
>>
>>             Aloha,
>>             Jim
>>
>>
>>
>>             On 8/10/15 10:24 AM, johanna curiel curiel wrote:
>>>             Hi Jim
>>>
>>>             I know you are very active ;-), I just wanted some
>>>             clarifications.
>>>
>>>             I was not sure if the the wiki editors had complete
>>>             access as admin to the wiki.
>>>
>>>             I will highlight the content, provide more relevant
>>>             links to link from the Home page and let you know when
>>>             ready.
>>>
>>>             I'll continue on the wiki editors mailing list.
>>>
>>>             regards
>>>
>>>             Johanna
>>>
>>>             On Mon, Aug 10, 2015 at 4:17 PM, Jim Manico
>>>             <jim.manico at owasp.org <mailto:jim.manico at owasp.org>> wrote:
>>>
>>>                 If you email the list it will get done shortly
>>>                 thereafter. Or even if you get delete access and
>>>                 delete yourself - just let us know.
>>>
>>>                 Johanna, I'm an active member and when I say I do
>>>                 something I do it. I hope that has been your
>>>                 experience with me over the past few years.
>>>
>>>                 I will not let you down. Please do not let this get
>>>                 in the way of doing good work. We have your back and
>>>                 want to help.
>>>
>>>                 Aloha,
>>>                 --
>>>                 Jim Manico
>>>                 Global Board Member
>>>                 OWASP Foundation
>>>                 https://www.owasp.org
>>>                 Join me at AppSecUSA <http://appsecusa.org/> 2015!
>>>
>>>                 On Aug 10, 2015, at 10:07 AM, johanna curiel curiel
>>>                 <johanna.curiel at owasp.org
>>>                 <mailto:johanna.curiel at owasp.org>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>                 Hi Jim
>>>>
>>>>                 If I take the time to highlight the irrelevant
>>>>                 content and provide a link to which one must go,
>>>>                 who has access and who will do the changes?
>>>>
>>>>                 I just hate to do a lot of work and nothing later
>>>>                 happens...or would the wiki editors provide me to
>>>>                 access to change this directly? How do the wiki
>>>>                 editors actually work? Do volunteers just label
>>>>                 things (with FIXME).
>>>>
>>>>                 I would like more clarification on this part since
>>>>                 the wiki editors page did not answer this
>>>>
>>>>                 regards
>>>>
>>>>                 Johanna
>>>>
>>>>                 On Mon, Aug 10, 2015 at 3:23 PM, Jim Manico
>>>>                 <jim.manico at owasp.org
>>>>                 <mailto:jim.manico at owasp.org>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>                     Thats why we have a group of editors who all
>>>>                     have appsec experience.
>>>>
>>>>                     https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-wiki-editors
>>>>
>>>>                     --
>>>>                     Jim Manico
>>>>                     Global Board Member
>>>>                     OWASP Foundation
>>>>                     https://www.owasp.org
>>>>                     Join me at AppSecUSA <http://appsecusa.org/> 2015!
>>>>
>>>>                     On Aug 10, 2015, at 3:30 AM, johanna curiel
>>>>                     curiel <johanna.curiel at owasp.org
>>>>                     <mailto:johanna.curiel at owasp.org>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>                     there is a clarification needed of something
>>>>>                     as simple as who is now Responsible for the
>>>>>                     Wiki it's not the community it's not a member
>>>>>                     of the board it is Paul and his hired staff.
>>>>>
>>>>>                     Thx Tom. I did not know that and I believe
>>>>>                     neither did Timo.
>>>>>
>>>>>                     >This is not OWASP of 2004... There is a large
>>>>>                     amounts of funding spent on people hired to
>>>>>                     manage to policy and work per there job
>>>>>                     descriptions. Let's be careful to let them do
>>>>>                     just that.
>>>>>
>>>>>                     How do this staff knows what kind of content
>>>>>                     is relevant or not? I don't think that formula
>>>>>                     is working well right now. That content has
>>>>>                     not been properly updated since Sarah's Baso's
>>>>>                     was Executive director.
>>>>>
>>>>>                     /If I/ was the content manager of this site,
>>>>>                     this was long time updated ;-P. If OWASP is
>>>>>                     already paying staff to do this then why is
>>>>>                     not updated? I think that the problem is that
>>>>>                     the staff is not familiar with the content so
>>>>>                     how can they change this content or know what
>>>>>                     is relevant?
>>>>>
>>>>>                     The actual content is very outdated and
>>>>>                     irrelevant to sec folks. Again I don't think
>>>>>                     paying another contractor without any know-how
>>>>>                     of the content will help clean the wiki
>>>>>                     properly and highlight relevant content.It
>>>>>                     will be a waste of money.
>>>>>
>>>>>                     Regards
>>>>>
>>>>>                     Johanna
>>>>>
>>>>>                     On Mon, Aug 10, 2015 at 9:17 AM, Tom Brennan
>>>>>                     <tomb at proactiverisk.com
>>>>>                     <mailto:tomb at proactiverisk.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>                         there is a clarification needed of
>>>>>                         something as simple as who is now
>>>>>                         Responsabile for the Wiki it's not the
>>>>>                         community it's not a member of the board
>>>>>                         it is Paul and his hired staff.
>>>>>
>>>>>                         Keep reading..
>>>>>
>>>>>                         The operational business of the foundation
>>>>>                         is handled by Paul Richie who was hired by
>>>>>                         the BoD.  reporting to him is a project
>>>>>                         coordinator job focus:
>>>>>                         https://www.owasp.org/images/a/a1/OWASP_Project_Coordinator-FabioTobiasAug25.pdf
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>                         and community manager
>>>>>                         https://www.owasp.org/index.php/OWASP_Jobs/Community_Manager
>>>>>
>>>>>                         Let's pause an review the above job
>>>>>                         descriptions
>>>>>
>>>>>                         The volunteers who create/edit content as
>>>>>                         part of the community should do so in step
>>>>>                         with the people who's paid job is to
>>>>>                         shepard reward encourage and drive this.
>>>>>                         Call it a committee task force wiki group
>>>>>                         what ever.... But end of day there is now
>>>>>                         a chain of command and that starts with
>>>>>                         the operations people that are measured on
>>>>>                         what they do and compensated for it.
>>>>>
>>>>>                         Paul should be and I am sure is asking and
>>>>>                         getting feedback from the employees/staff
>>>>>                         on how to approach this and ultimately it
>>>>>                         is his decisions on the logistics of the
>>>>>                         operation.  If it works GREAT if it does
>>>>>                         not, try try again
>>>>>
>>>>>                         This is not OWASP of 2004... There is a
>>>>>                         large amounts of funding spent on people
>>>>>                         hired to manage to policy and work per
>>>>>                         there job descriptions. Let's be careful
>>>>>                         to let them do just that.
>>>>>
>>>>>                         Collaborate with them but don't step on
>>>>>                         over or around them. If there is a problem
>>>>>                         escalate as a complaint if needed.
>>>>>
>>>>>                         Plans (next 30 days)
>>>>>
>>>>>                         Progress (accomplishments of last 30 days)
>>>>>
>>>>>                         Problems (board meeting agenda item for
>>>>>                         vote that the staff can't handle without
>>>>>                         guidance an a vote)
>>>>>
>>>>>                         As simple as that we should be able to
>>>>>                         communicate what is going on at OWASP
>>>>>
>>>>>                         IMHO edit and redirect away, don't delete.
>>>>>                         It's a wiki
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>                         On Aug 10, 2015, at 8:47 AM, johanna
>>>>>                         curiel curiel <johanna.curiel at owasp.org
>>>>>                         <mailto:johanna.curiel at owasp.org>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>                         I think if you give Johanna and I delete
>>>>>>                         rights on the wiki it would do much more
>>>>>>                         good as opposed to hiring somebody who is
>>>>>>                         not familiar with the content or the
>>>>>>                         projects.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                         If this becomes a project under our
>>>>>>                         guidance(which I think unfamiliar people
>>>>>>                         to the content cannot provide) is essential
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                         Example
>>>>>>                         From the home page you get this link:
>>>>>>                         https://www.owasp.org/index.php/Category:How_To
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                         This is very old stuff and there are more
>>>>>>                         relevant content and projects that
>>>>>>                         promoting from the home page the "OWASP
>>>>>>                         LiveCD Education Project (SpoC 2007)" and
>>>>>>                         "Webscarab" .
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                         What we need is a _technical editor _to
>>>>>>                         help us re-write and correct the text.
>>>>>>                         This way we can highlight relevant
>>>>>>                         content and there is so much but is not
>>>>>>                         properly promoted.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                         This whole section is really VERY
>>>>>>                         outdated and irrelevant right now,
>>>>>>                         especially from the homepage
>>>>>>                         <Screenshot 2015-08-10 08.42.41.png>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                         With all due respect, you need to know
>>>>>>                         the content in order to direct users to
>>>>>>                         relevant one. We know which is
>>>>>>                         the relevant content(especially
>>>>>>                         people familiar with the latest and
>>>>>>                         updated projects)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                         We can make a plan of what will be clean
>>>>>>                         up before deleting or doing anything, but
>>>>>>                         it's clear that without know-how of the
>>>>>>                         content, hiring someone will be not very
>>>>>>                         efficient or effective in my opinion.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                         regards
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                         Johanna
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                         On Mon, Aug 10, 2015 at 6:59 AM, Jim
>>>>>>                         Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org
>>>>>>                         <mailto:jim.manico at owasp.org>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                             I support giving you both delete
>>>>>>                             access so long as you send a note to
>>>>>>                             the wiki editor list and just let us
>>>>>>                             know what you are up to...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                             --
>>>>>>                             Jim Manico
>>>>>>                             Global Board Member
>>>>>>                             OWASP Foundation
>>>>>>                             https://www.owasp.org
>>>>>>                             Join me at AppSecUSA
>>>>>>                             <http://appsecusa.org/> 2015!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                             On Aug 9, 2015, at 11:21 PM, Timo
>>>>>>                             Goosen <timo.goosen at owasp.org
>>>>>>                             <mailto:timo.goosen at owasp.org>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                             I still feel that people on the
>>>>>>>                             project task force should have
>>>>>>>                             delete rights on the wiki.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                             If people want to see stuff for
>>>>>>>                             archiving purposes they can use
>>>>>>>                             archive.org <http://archive.org> to
>>>>>>>                             view the page.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                             The owasp wiki looks sloppy at the
>>>>>>>                             moment and we should clean it up.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                             I think if you give Johanna and I
>>>>>>>                             delete rights on the wiki it would
>>>>>>>                             do much more good as opposed to
>>>>>>>                             hiring somebody who is not familiar
>>>>>>>                             with the content or the projects.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                             Regards.
>>>>>>>                             Timo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                             On Sun, Aug 9, 2015 at 11:26 PM, Jim
>>>>>>>                             Manico <jim.manico at owasp.org
>>>>>>>                             <mailto:jim.manico at owasp.org>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                                  >There would need to be a
>>>>>>>                                 category that replaces "FIXME"
>>>>>>>                                 with "Archived" or something
>>>>>>>                                 similar for the archived page.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                                 That is currently the
>>>>>>>                                 "historical" flag.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                                 |[[Categorie:FIXME/historical]]| 	out
>>>>>>>                                 of date but archived for
>>>>>>>                                 historical context
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                                 Some content is good to save,
>>>>>>>                                 some is just junk. The
>>>>>>>                                 wiki-editors group is set up to
>>>>>>>                                 answer those questions.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                                 https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-wiki-editors
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                                 Aloha,
>>>>>>>                                 Jim
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                                 Another issue I just thought
>>>>>>>>                                 of: If a page is simply
>>>>>>>>                                 archived it will still show up
>>>>>>>>                                 in search. This is not a
>>>>>>>>                                 problem if the page redirects
>>>>>>>>                                 to a newer or more relevant
>>>>>>>>                                 one. But could be if it is not
>>>>>>>>                                 clearly tagged as an
>>>>>>>>                                 archived/outdated page.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                                 Noreen Whysel
>>>>>>>>                                 Community Manager
>>>>>>>>                                 OWASP Foundation
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                                 On Aug 9, 2015, at 4:24 PM, Bev
>>>>>>>>                                 Corwin <bev.corwin at owasp.org
>>>>>>>>                                 <mailto:bev.corwin at owasp.org>>
>>>>>>>>                                 wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                                 Nice explanation Noreen, thank
>>>>>>>>>                                 you, just curious, do you
>>>>>>>>>                                 think that it is important to
>>>>>>>>>                                 reference the history details
>>>>>>>>>                                 on the pages, or would the
>>>>>>>>>                                 automated history / changes
>>>>>>>>>                                 tracking information be enough
>>>>>>>>>                                 for anyone looking for any
>>>>>>>>>                                 archives?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                                 Bev
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                                 On Sun, Aug 9, 2015 at 2:38
>>>>>>>>>                                 PM, Noreen Whysel
>>>>>>>>>                                 <noreen.whysel at owasp.org
>>>>>>>>>                                 <mailto:noreen.whysel at owasp.org>>
>>>>>>>>>                                 wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                                     Redirects are simple. Add
>>>>>>>>>                                     #REDIRECT [[:NewPage]] to
>>>>>>>>>                                     the edit field and it will
>>>>>>>>>                                     redirect to the new page.
>>>>>>>>>                                     All the old page history
>>>>>>>>>                                     is saved and viewed very
>>>>>>>>>                                     easily by typing the URL,
>>>>>>>>>                                     https://www.owasp.org/index.php?title=Old_Page_Title&action=history.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                                 _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>                                 Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>>>                                 Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>>>                                 <mailto:Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org>
>>>>>>>>                                 https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                                 -- 
>>>>>>>                                 Jim Manico
>>>>>>>                                 Global Board Member
>>>>>>>                                 OWASP Foundation
>>>>>>>                                 https://www.owasp.org
>>>>>>>                                 Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>                                 _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>                                 Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>>                                 Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>>                                 <mailto:Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org>
>>>>>>>                                 https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                             _______________________________________________
>>>>>>                             Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>                             Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>                             <mailto:Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org>
>>>>>>                             https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>                         _______________________________________________
>>>>>>                         Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>                         Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>                         <mailto:Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org>
>>>>>>                         https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
>>
>>             -- 
>>             Jim Manico
>>             Global Board Member
>>             OWASP Foundation
>>             https://www.owasp.org
>>             Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!
>>
>>
>>             _______________________________________________
>>             Owasp-board mailing list
>>             Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>             <mailto:Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org>
>>             https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>
>>
>>
>
>     -- 
>     Jim Manico
>     Global Board Member
>     OWASP Foundation
>     https://www.owasp.org
>     Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!
>
>

-- 
Jim Manico
Global Board Member
OWASP Foundation
https://www.owasp.org
Join me at AppSecUSA 2015!

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