[Owasp-board] 2014 Board Meeting Dates

Michael Coates michael.coates at owasp.org
Tue Dec 17 22:44:20 UTC 2013


I understand. So I see two items:

1. Scheduling that works best for the board
2. Length and frequency of the meetings

Everyone agrees we should work together on item #1 and will do so with a
doodle when the time comes. However, scheduling is based upon our approach
in item #2.

If I'm understanding correctly Josh is asking that we revisit item #2. For
many years we held monthly 1-2 hr meetings. The last vote was to move to
quarterly 6 hr meetings based on our experiences and value with the longer
spots. I'm hesitant to reopen an item we've just recently agreed upon, but
there's certainly no harm in discussion and adjusting if we have new items
to consider.

Does anyone have comments, concerns, or suggestions on the length and
frequency of the meetings?
Eoin -  voiced his opinions in support of meetings outside of business
hours and also offered another suggestion of 2 meetings per quarter, 3 hrs
each. One on a weekend and one on a weekday.
Michael - I definitely think the monthly meeting had less value then the
long meetings. My first preference is the quarterly 6 hour meeting. I'm
also open to Eoin's idea of 2 3 hr meetings - 1 weekday, 1 weekend.

Others?





--
Michael Coates
Chair, Global Board
OWASP
@_mwc



On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 2:12 PM, Josh Sokol <josh.sokol at owasp.org> wrote:

> I'm not sure you understand.  I'm not proposing an alternative.  I'm
> proposing that we re-evaluate what works best for the Board.  If I proposed
> an alternative, it would be based on what is best for me exclusively and
> ignores what works for others.  Maybe we can put together a Doodle with
> some pre-defined two-hour time blocks and see if we can find something that
> works well for everyone.
>
> For example, Fridays 12 PM CST would work just fine for me and would be 6
> PM for Eoin in Dublin (after billable hours) and Fabio and noon in Hong
> Kong for Tobias.  Would that work?
>
> ~josh
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 2:34 PM, Michael Coates <michael.coates at owasp.org>wrote:
>
>> I'm on board with finding something that works for all.
>>
>> What alternative would you like to propose for consideration and vote?
>>
>> Currently our approach is to find 4 dates where we have 6 hour board
>> meetings. The goal is to attach these to in person events when possible
>> (AppSec conferences) since there is value in having people together in
>> person for the board meeting. When not possible we are aiming for
>> Saturdays.
>>
>> Would you like to propose an alternative for a vote or are you good
>> working through the above process to find 4 dates that work for everyone?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Michael
>>
>>
>> --
>> Michael Coates
>> Chair, Global Board
>> OWASP
>> @_mwc
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 12:25 PM, Josh Sokol <josh.sokol at owasp.org>wrote:
>>
>>> Michael,
>>>
>>> I understand the requirement and am not debating it nor the merits of
>>> having regular meetings.  In fact, my cause for concern here is to ensure
>>> that everyone (including myself) is able to meet this requirement.  But
>>> holding the new Board accountable to the previous Board's scheduling
>>> desires does not seem like the appropriate way to ensure this.  Hence, my
>>> request to re-organize based on the collective needs and desires of all of
>>> the Board members.  I'm sure that your unanimous vote was appropriate for
>>> those who served before, but it is irrelevant for the new Board.  I'm not
>>> sure what the issue is with me requesting a new vote on the dates that work
>>> best for everyone.  This seems like a fairly simple and benign request to
>>> ensure that everyone can participate to their fullest extent and by
>>> shooting it down it feels like the needs and desires of the new Board
>>> members are being subjugated by those of the old Board members.  If we are
>>> all truly equals here, then trying to find a schedule that works toward
>>> everyone's best interest shouldn't be an issue.  Simply put, I had no say
>>> in the Board schedule previously, but would like to be able to have a voice
>>> in the one that I am required by the Bylaws to uphold.
>>>
>>> ~josh
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 1:59 PM, Michael Coates <
>>> michael.coates at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> The attendance requirements are in the bylaws and have been there for
>>>> quite some time (i.e. before the move to 4 quarterly meetings). There are
>>>> many items in the bylaws determined by previous boards that apply to all of
>>>> us
>>>> Please be sure to be aware of all of these responsibilities in your
>>>> role.
>>>>
>>>> The purpose of discussing the dates now is so we can find dates that
>>>> allow everyone to attend. With our advanced planning we can all plan to
>>>> attend all 4 events and in the event of an emergency we'll still make 3 of
>>>> the 4.
>>>>
>>>> I'll leave it to others if they want to hold a new vote on an issue we
>>>> just voted in a few weeks back. No preference from me here. My personal
>>>> view is the unanimous vote was based on a good plan and feedback from many
>>>> board meetings over many years.
>>>>
>>>> -Michael
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Michael Coates
>>>> Chair, Global Board
>>>> OWASP
>>>> @_mwc
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 11:00 AM, Josh Sokol <josh.sokol at owasp.org>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I have requested access to the document.  Please approve.
>>>>>
>>>>> I strongly disagree with your recommendation.  It is based on a vote
>>>>> that took place when 3 out of 7 of the Board members weren't even able to
>>>>> participate.  That's not even a quorum amongst the current Board.  I
>>>>> believe that the dates should be decided as a group with the participation
>>>>> of the full group of Board members who will be subject to the dates.  It is
>>>>> unfair to enforce a 3/4 attendance policy based on dates and days that were
>>>>> not agreed to in advance.  With each new Board, we should be re-evaluating
>>>>> several many factors to ensure that our selected dates and times are good
>>>>> for everybody:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1) The day of the week.
>>>>> 2) The time of the day.
>>>>> 3) The duration of the meeting.
>>>>>
>>>>> If we can't get a quorum agreeing to these factors, then there is no
>>>>> point in having a meeting as nothing can be voted on.
>>>>>
>>>>> ~josh
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 12:22 PM, Michael Coates <
>>>>> michael.coates at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Board + Sarah,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To facilitate suggested times can you help me complete the following?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This page has everyone's primary timezone and which appsec events
>>>>>> they're attending.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://docs.google.com/a/owasp.org/document/d/1zFDK7FYmk1ZSqjiJImxLrfX36xtaHXOsq67IwT2iq3w/edit
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Michael Coates
>>>>>> Chair, Global Board
>>>>>> OWASP
>>>>>> @_mwc
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 10:08 AM, Michael Coates <
>>>>>> michael.coates at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Unless we have a large group that wants to dramatically change our
>>>>>>> approach I recommend we stay with our unanimous vote from the board
>>>>>>> meeting. I recognize that people have other things going on in life, we all
>>>>>>> do, and the decision to volunteer time towards an OWASP board role is no
>>>>>>> small commitment. The goal of scheduling the meetings for all of 2014 is so
>>>>>>> we can plan and accommodate these important meetings.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'll start a doodle with several options for us to evaluate. We'll
>>>>>>> need to agree on dates that can accommodate everyone with the understanding
>>>>>>> that attendance (in person or virtual) is required at 3 of 4 meetings.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -Michael
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Michael Coates
>>>>>>> Chair, Global Board
>>>>>>> OWASP
>>>>>>> @_mwc
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 5:24 AM, Eoin <eoinkeary at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Could we do two 3h meetings a quarter?
>>>>>>>> 1 on weekends and 1 during the working week....
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 17 December 2013 12:55, Josh Sokol <josh.sokol at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Sure.  If you were always 100% booked it could.  Likewise, it will
>>>>>>>>> always take that time away from my family and force me to cancel recurring
>>>>>>>>> lessons for my kids that I've already got planned.  I've got two days a
>>>>>>>>> week to spend with my family.  You've got 5 days to work.  Regardless, I'm
>>>>>>>>> willing to compromise, but will not do two 6hr Sat meetings.  One would be
>>>>>>>>> hard enough to explain.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ~josh
>>>>>>>>> On Dec 17, 2013 2:18 AM, "Eoin Keary" <eoinkeary at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I can't do 6hr meets during working week.
>>>>>>>>>> I have bills to pay. That could cost me circa $1200 to do the
>>>>>>>>>> meeting.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Eoin Keary
>>>>>>>>>> Owasp Global Board
>>>>>>>>>> +353 87 977 2988
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 17 Dec 2013, at 02:12, Josh Sokol <josh.sokol at owasp.org>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Seems kinda crappy that the old board decides the duration and
>>>>>>>>>> days that the new board will meet.  I'd like to propose a new vote amongst
>>>>>>>>>> the new board in order to determine whether this is still the most
>>>>>>>>>> convenient for everyone.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Personally, I have no issue with 6 hr meetings if its during the
>>>>>>>>>> work week.  I also have no issue with shorter meetings if they are on the
>>>>>>>>>> weekend.  I take issue with the combination as it takes significant time
>>>>>>>>>> away from my family and I already have things scheduled for my children on
>>>>>>>>>> Saturdays.
>>>>>>>>>> On Dec 16, 2013 6:28 PM, "Michael Coates" <
>>>>>>>>>> michael.coates at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> It's not just me. This was voted on during the board meeting at
>>>>>>>>>>> Europe. 6 hr meetings provide time to get stuff done. The consensus was
>>>>>>>>>>> that each year the board would plan the events for the following year. They
>>>>>>>>>>> would be on Saturdays or in some cases week days to align with AppSec
>>>>>>>>>>> events.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Vote was aug 19 -
>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.owasp.org/index.php/OWASP_Board_Votes
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Regarding the selected dates, 3 out of 4 are good, but I can't
>>>>>>>>>>> do the June 27 date.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> -Michael
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> Michael Coates
>>>>>>>>>>> Chair, Global Board
>>>>>>>>>>> OWASP
>>>>>>>>>>> @_mwc
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 10:07 AM, Josh Sokol <
>>>>>>>>>>> josh.sokol at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> If we were only doing 1-2 hours once a month, then Saturday
>>>>>>>>>>>> would probably be fine, but since it seemed that Michael really wanted to
>>>>>>>>>>>> go for longer meetings once a quarter, I would much prefer to do these
>>>>>>>>>>>> during the week where it does not impact the limited amount of time I have
>>>>>>>>>>>> with my family.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ~josh
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 12:03 PM, Sarah Baso <
>>>>>>>>>>>> sarah.baso at owasp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Board member -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> *No meeting next monday (23rd), I will update the meeting
>>>>>>>>>>>>> invite. *
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> We do need to finalize the meeting dates for next year to get
>>>>>>>>>>>>> them on the calendar so everyone can plan accordingly:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Here were my suggestions to get the ball rolling:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    Saturday April 12 or 19 (after end of Q1 with sufficient
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    time for Alison to reconcile reports) We also should have a wrap up of 2013
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    finances by then for review
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    Friday June 27 in person in Cambridge (conference is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    Monday - Thursday June 23-26th)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    Monday September 15th in person in Denver (conference is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    Tuesday - Friday Sept 16-19th)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    Saturday Nov 8 or 15 - new board members are elected and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>    planning for 2015.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thoughts?
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sarah
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Executive Director
>>>>>>>>>>>>> OWASP Foundation
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> sarah.baso at owasp.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> +1.312.869.2779
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>>>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Eoin Keary
>>>>>>>> OWASP Global Board Member
>>>>>>>> OWASP Code Review Guide Lead Author
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/EoinKeary
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://twitter.com/BCCRiskAdvisory
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Owasp-board mailing list
>>>>>> Owasp-board at lists.owasp.org
>>>>>> https://lists.owasp.org/mailman/listinfo/owasp-board
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
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